SAMM HENSHAW
Music Columnist, Gracey Mae, spoke with Samm Henshaw to unpack, new music Jumoke, how he got to where he is today and when beliefs, come into play .
Interview GRACEY MAE
Hi Samm, welcome to Tirade World ?
S: Hey! Sorry it looks like I’m talking to someone else; its just this beautiful dog, Lily. She likes attention and if I stop giving it to her, I’ll get into trouble.
I get it , but I don’t as I am not a pet person?
S: She’s like the best dog ever. She literally is, she’s the type of dog that could convince anyone to like dogs!
I could change if the Lord speaks and the spirit moves me but until then.. on the topic you are a PK (Pastor’s kid) who started drumming at four, how did you discover an instrument at such a young age?
S: I would watch young people play in the worship team or in the band, and so that was something that I felt attracted to. This is probably a bad example, but when we think about guys in the ends, the rock stars and the superstars to them, are the guys that are out there shotting; coming back with nice cars and they look like life is going well for them. I think it's weirdly similar in any other environment, where if there's people that look like the coolest people, or they're doing something that seems special, you gravitate toward them. You gravitate toward what they do. For me, I would always see musicians, and be like, “I want to do that”, and I haven't looked back since.
Talk to us about Grandma prophesying that you were going to be in music.
S: That's one of those things I think I've only said once. My parents told me a while ago. She said, “Get that boy an instrument because he's going to be a musician”, so they did. They didn't play around with that. They actually bought me every instrument I can play now.
How many is that - six?
S: I'm going to say five and singing. Singing was the last thing I did. They bought me a microphone when I was a kid. They bought me a guitar. I had talking drums when I was a kid. I had a full drum kit. I had a piano. Everything ended up broken somewhere but I always had some type of instrument in my household.
And did Granny live to see the fulfilment of her prophecy?
S: She's still with us. She's not 100% well, but I'm so grateful to God for that woman. I love her to death. I saw her in 2021 in Nigeria, so I'm going to probably go again next year just to see her and hang out with her for a bit. But yeah, she's still with us and she's still great.
That's great. And you mentioned the broken instruments. I heard you were a bad breed, bad youth, bad child, just bad.
S: Yeah, I was the worst of the worst.
So where did it stem from?
S: I think it's funny. I was having this chat with my dad the other day, and we actually sat down for like two or three hours; there was just so much to unpack. I think it one of the things that stemmed from being a pastor's kid. My parents were amazing. My parents are still amazing but I think that there was a pressure that came from other people in my life, especially older people, that made me feel like I had to be more; it's almost like being born into royalty. I think that's kind of the only way I can describe it. People are expecting you to act a certain way or behave a certain way, and all you're thinking in your head is, “I don't know who I am yet. I've not figured out where I fit in all of this. I don't understand the world yet. I don't know much about myself”. Thank God for my parents, because a lot of what they did to me growing up was to help me understand who I was. A lot of [my behaviour] came out as rebellion. A lot of it came out in the form of misunderstandings at times as well. I can definitely say I was a bad kid; I'll always admit that but there were a lot of times it was just like, “people just don't get me, people don't understand”. That wasn't entirely just because of the PK thing. I was just trying to figure out who I was. This is a very short answer (laugh). [Dad and I] ended up sitting down and having this really long conversation about that. He was just really understanding as much as he could; it was really nice to have that moment with him and really be able to be like “this is actually what I think went wrong”. One thing that I will always thank my parents for is not giving up on me. There were points when people were ready to send me to Nigeria. My dad always said, that he had a moment where he heard God say to him, “If you send that boy away, he's never going to forgive you”. And he was just like, “right, not running it”. Same with my mum.
As you approach 30, do you know who you are now?
S: Yeah, but I also think I'm still figuring it out. I'm still on a journey. I don't think anyone lives to really fully understand who they are - I think we all kind of die trying to. I think we're supposed to constantly grow, constantly learn, constantly evolve and develop. So for me, I think a lot of things I didn't understand when I was younger, I understand now. A lot of behaviors I displayed came from a place of curiosity when I was younger. There's a lot of areas now in my life that I could say I know myself, but there's still a lot of areas that I'm just figuring out, and I'm learning that it’s okay.
Do you use music as therapy, a diary, a timestamp or something else entirely?
S: In my music I've been able to talk about depression and anxiety; I've been able to talk about joy and emotions I felt. No one told me to do that. Those are the things that, naturally, when I step into the room and was given the opportunity to, I ended up choosing to say. Those were the things that I was feeling in the moment. When I look back at those things, it’s become a bit of therapy but I think the new lesson that I'm really learning - and it's funny because it's entirely what my next project is about - is that we create for ourselves. It's going to be therapy for you, but at some point, once you're kind of over the therapy, it's going to be that for someone else.
Kudos to you, man. Family can be really funny, especially when it comes to money so to give the masters of ‘Jumoke’ to the kids is really upstanding..
S: There’s a scripture that basically says, just give and it'll come back to you. One thing that I've realized about my life is that since I started in music, this is the only job I've ever had. Since I've started in music, I've never struggled for money. That's not to brag; I just think I've been blessed. I come from a family of people who give. I have learned that it’s probably just the best thing to do. Everyone that I'm surrounded by gives. My girlfriend is such a huge giver. When it comes to the money thing, I have other songs, I will write other songs, and I will make other things that will make money. Why do I need to be precious about giving away money for a song like that? It doesn't feel that complicated to me, it's not like I'm giving to receive; it's just someone else needs it; and probably need it more than I will. That's not the first time I've exercised that, I've given away more in splits to people who deserved it. I've written whole songs, and I've given away 50% of my splits; songs that have helped shape my career. For me, I still ended up making bigger songs that made more money so that just became a lesson for me. My life is a testament to that.
You just touched on your girlfriend. Are we going to hear more love songs on the brand new project you've just teased?
S: This next project is specifically not about me - which is one of the bigger appeals. The title is ‘For Someone Somewhere Who Isn’t Us’. It came from a place of me struggling to actually create because I was struggling to find a thing to talk about. I was so caught up in needing to experience more life and needing to do more things. You know being in a relationship means that I'm really happy. Sometimes I feel like we kind of have to talk about negative stuff or whatever, but everything's been good. So it's just like, I still want to take in stuff, I still want to experience things so a lot of this project is me picking from other people's experiences. There's maybe one or two I can relate to. Essentially, I want it to kind of be a body of work that everyone can relate to.
Where was your thought process when deciding to release ‘Jumoke’?
S: I think there were a number of thoughts that came into my head, one of the main ones being, how do I honour Uncle Steve? I don't know if words can describe how big of an impact he had on my life, and still has on my life to this day. There were things that if I had an issue with in the music industry, he was the person that I was constantly going to talk to - about my fears, the things that I wasn't sure on, what I could do. Steve was my cousin through marriage, but he really felt like he was blood to me. I can sit here and tell loads of stories on how much he mentored me and how much he put into my life. I've seen what music has been able to do for my life from a financial aspect. When you get a song that does well, you see something that’s life-changing. I've had that many times with many songs in my life. I've been able to buy a property from it. I've been able to live a really nice life based on it. I'm really big on family so it was easy when it came to handing over the Masters to make sure that the kids were going to see money from the song. I just thought to myself, this is the simplest thing that I can do that can contribute towards their futures. Losing a dad is something that I've never experienced. I'm so grateful for my father. He is one of the most present people in my life. I cannot describe how present my dad is. And the thought of losing him at such a young age… I don't know what I would do. Steve was a very, very present father. I always say that for your kids to see you and still be excited by seeing you is crazy. Do you know how good you have to be for your kids to be gassed? Especially in this day and age.
If I say the word ill-funk, what does that mean to you?
S: Why are you going back? (Laughs) I was in a band in university called Ill Funk and we were just basically writing our songs and doing things like D'Angelo, Quest Love, and others.
And Ska…
S: Yes, we were doing Ska. There was no one on my course that was into it. A lot of people that wanted to do the music were very much into heavy metal and rock - I really have come to appreciate heavy metal more than anything, I've always loved rock music - but when you're in an environment that you're not familiar with and you find people who are into a similar thing, you click, I had that with the boys. We were just all into grooves, nice pockets and soul music. We ended up doing a bunch of gigs. It was such a fun, incredible period in my life. I love those guys to bits.
So that was uni time; you were gigging a lot but the grades weren't doing too well.
S: Yeah, the grades weren't grading.
So you were forced to take a break but then you got to host a show after a year off as your uni project. Your team secretly invited a few industry heads and the rest is history. What was that moment like?
SAMM: It's not what you would think it was. The feeling of the gig was amazing but the industry side of it was more drama. There was a lot of secrecy. Basically, I didn't know that half the industry was at that gig; I just thought that people just came to watch us play. I can be quite naive about stuff. So these people show up to the gig and I got introduced to the people who wanted to sign me. I secretly got brought back to London because I was meant to work on, a Rudimental joint. Another funny story, that ended up being a really big song, that and an Ed Sheeran song. I hated it, I sang it, and I felt like that's kind of moist. It ended up becoming a big song that Ed Sheeran sang. I was also, very anti-establishment. I was very much okay with sitting in my dorm, smoking as much weed as I could, doing as many drugs as I could, and making music with no one disturbing me. And so, being at this point where I've been brought into London. I basically found out that it was all kind of a ploy to get me to go and be in London so I could do meetings with these different labels. At that point, I didn't know if I actually wanted that. There was so much that happened in that moment and it was also fast. I don't remember, how I felt in regards to excitement or anything.
I feel like bidding wars sound cool, when you're not the subject of the bidding…
S: Yes, yes. I think it was a different time which sounds crazy because it was 2014/15. Everyone's telling you that it’s an amazing thing to happen and you're getting offered a ton of money. Again, thank God for my parents because it was always “approach with caution”. “Everything that glitters isn't gold and the stuff that's been presented to you comes at a price” - you really have to understand that. I thank God because I had an amazing experience being signed to a major label - which isn't the case for a lot of people - but for me, it was an amazing experience. Before going in, you're apprehensive because you've heard stories, you've seen all the documentaries, every artist has been screwed over in one way or the other by the industry.
It's giving the TLC documentary. Talking about life stories, how does Lewisham and the Salvation Army play a part in your story?
S: Oh, you want to go there! Wow, how do I even start on that? How do you even know about that? I've never discussed this with anyone in an interview. That's crazy. So basically, I grew up in this church. I was born and raised in this church that was very much like my family. There's people from that church that I'm good friends with that have gone on to do incredible things. One day, something changed with the church leadership so my dad felt compelled to leave—nothing negative at all. There's no scandal; it was just, this is where our journey ends at this church, so we leave. Then my dad gets a call to become the head pastor of this church in Lewisham and that church was in the Salvation Army building. One of my closest and bestest friends in the world to date is from that church and that's the church I still go to now. I have so many memories from that church. That is where I became a better musician. That is where I honed my skills. That's where I actually grew as a person. There was so much of my life and my world that revolved around this Salvation Army building in Lewisham. I remember that we would do rehearsals every Saturday and we were like 13/14 - we were technically putting in 10,000 hours in every week. It's not normal to be rehearsing every week at 13. Every other kid was going off and doing whatever; we didn't realize we were just becoming better musicians every week. All of that happened in that church.
Here is me trying to put something poetic together. The Army talks about militancy and discipline which is what you learned there. Salvation references music saving you from life on the road. Not that you were ever on the road...
S: Yeah, I wish them well...Hmm! Actually, I don’t wish them worse. Wait, recently I think, I did wish somebody worse but generally…[laughs] I had a lot of opportunities where I could have been; that's a whole story for another day, but those are the parts that played in the really dark times of my life.
What I’m hearing is church really impacted you as a person?
SAMM: I think one thing I've learned is that it's good to serve. I think that’s why I'm in the position I'm in. A lot of it has to do with service. I think serving your community, serving the church, and serving Jesus is very important. It's the same thing with my friends who are doing really well in life - they're all in music and they just keep serving. There was never a point where they were just like, “I'm too good for this now”. I think there's an element of humility you need to have when you enter this industry. Fame isn't normal. We should not be exposed to that much level of adoration and attention. It's worship. When someone thinks you're amazing, it's hard not to tell yourself that you're not, and that's why we get affected by one person saying we're crap. Criticism should be normal in our lives. People not liking us should actually be normal. That's the other reason I have a really negative thing with social media now: it's geared towards attention. Before social media was as big as it is now, you were just trying to be the best in your field. Now you're not fighting to be the best in not just your field, but for attention from everyone. So it's no longer like, are you the best musician? It’s now, are you the best influencer musician? Are you the best influencer actor? Are you the best influencer comedian? The concept of fame is weird. To me. I've always thought it was weird. People now feel entitled to your life.
We've talked about heritage, hurdles and hope. What would you like to leave us with?
S: A huge thank you. Thank you for the support. Thank you for the opportunity to be a part of your life in any way. I keep recognising that, more and more each day, this thing is really an opportunity. I don't know if I believe I deserve it. I believe that I've been given an opportunity, and I'm grateful for the opportunity. People choose to listen to me; people choose to pay to come to a show; people choose to like me. I'm just grateful for being chosen by everyone, including God. I’m just grateful.